New M1D specials at CMP

[sandsnow]

Hello all
First it's been a long time since I posted. I check in to lurk every now and then. The last sales email from the CMP got me a little excited to say the least. I thought I would try this out here before I decide if I'm going to post it at CMP forum. What I got, even if true would somehow be ok with the "true believers" over there anyway. So here goes.....

The latest offering by the CMP is an "M1D" with a new barrel. Not sure if the barrel has the correct drawing number.
First off what is a real M1D?
I'm thinking it is any receiver that has a "555" barrel screwed into it by a U.S. Army Arsenal plus the special handguard. Whatever else was done to the rifle is not important here.
The key thing is WHO screwed the barrel into the receiver.
If the above is wrong then never mind and you can stop reading.

Question: Did these M1D specials being sold by the CMP originally arrive as a M1D from the Army? That's the only way I could see these an authentic M1D. If they did you should get the original barrel as some sort of provenance.

If the CMP is grabbing any old receiver and screwing in a NOS barrel, then to me that's a fake M1D and should be sold as a reproduction. That's because it's no different than Joe blow putting one together in his garage. The CMP is not a U.S. Army Arsenal.

What will the C of A state on it?
These reproductions would devalue all other genuine M1D s sold by the CMP unless some distinction is made.

Any thoughts?

[Brinks352]

The way I read the email was that they took (I assume) grade A or grade B receivers, reparked them and added NIW USGI 555 marked barrel that date between 52'-53. The fact that they are reparked should keep them from being pawned off as true USGI.

We will see with all the comments that I am sure are going to come.

[Punch The Clown]

Listen, I parted out my mint M1D a few years ago because of all the "CMP Documented" hype. Without papers the rifle wasn't worth squat. Worth much more parted out. Then the behind the scenes film showing the CMP assembling rifles from parts-by the truckload. Now I regret getting rid of my M1D. I don't think that CMP provenance is worth squat. But the faithful continue to believe.

[ordmm]

The great thing about all this is the CMP makes repro legit. It's a repro sniper rifle with a repro scope, with repro wood that has repro metal. Kind of like one of the fancy commemorative Garands that were sold, or the re-builds that were sold in a fancy wood box. At the end of the day, like a new car, drive it off the lot and deduct 20-30% of the price you paid. Obviously the CMP has to find it much easier to create various Garand configurations that build out all the same, keep the local folks employed, and garner the least bitching and moaning about crappy wood-poor finish-don't meet grading-sight is loose-......less whining to deal with when what you ship is all cookie cutter product.

[ordmm]

Hello all

The latest offering by the CMP is an "M1D" with a new barrel. Not sure if the barrel has the correct drawing number.
First off what is a real M1D?
I'm thinking it is any receiver that has a "555" barrel screwed into it by a U.S. Army Arsenal plus the special handguard. Whatever else was done to the rifle is not important here.
The key thing is WHO screwed the barrel into the receiver.
If the above is wrong then never mind and you can stop reading.

Question: Did these M1D specials being sold by the CMP originally arrive as a M1D from the Army? That's the only way I could see these an authentic M1D. If they did you should get the original barrel as some sort of provenance.

If the CMP is grabbing any old receiver and screwing in a NOS barrel, then to me that's a fake M1D and should be sold as a reproduction. That's because it's no different than Joe blow putting one together in his garage. The CMP is not a U.S. Army Arsenal.

What will the C of A state on it?
These reproductions would devalue all other genuine M1D s sold by the CMP unless some distinction is made.

Any thoughts?

OK...The latest CMP is $2K. Subtract the value of repop scope and mount and it pretty much comes to the price on a previous used D that the CMP offers so maybe to price is not so bad. If the issue is who and where the barrel was installed is an issue I don't think anyone really knows where all the used D rifles had their barrels installed or by whom...pretty much the case of most all used GI D model rifles--as the D itself was designed to standard rifle could be converted by any GI shop by a barrel change. "Provenance" becomes subject to interpretation I guess for many of the rifles that pass through the CMP and ultimately up to the buyer to determine what feeds the need.

[sandsnow]

The great thing about all this is the CMP makes repro legit. It's a repro sniper rifle with a repro scope, with repro wood that has repro metal. Kind of like one of the fancy commemorative Garands that were sold, or the re-builds that were sold in a fancy wood box. At the end of the day, like a new car, drive it off the lot and deduct 20-30% of the price you paid. Obviously the CMP has to find it much easier to create various Garand configurations that build out all the same, keep the local folks employed, and garner the least bitching and moaning about crappy wood-poor finish-don't meet grading-sight is loose-......less whining to deal with when what you ship is all cookie cutter product.

I wouldn't have my panties in a bunch if they were sold as repro rifles.
If that C of A says M1D without the word reproduction, then this is the new Mitchell's Mausers.

In the back of my mind I'll never let this go, but I got more important carp which will soon overshadow this controversy like the last time.
The last time was the guy who got an M1D from CMP that did not have a 555 barrel.According to CMP the barrel was legit. I asked CMP directly and I was not allowed to know the source of this knowledge. The CMP swapped the barrel, big O blessed it on the forum and peace settled over the masses. I emailed Bruce Canfield and he said if the big O says it's legit, then that's good enough for him.

[sandsnow]

OK...The latest CMP is $2K. Subtract the value of repop scope and mount and it pretty much comes to the price on a previous used D that the CMP offers so maybe to price is not so bad. If the issue is who and where the barrel was installed is an issue I don't think anyone really knows where all the used D rifles had their barrels installed or by whom...pretty much the case of most all used GI D model rifles--as the D itself was designed to standard rifle could be converted by any GI shop by a barrel change. "Provenance" becomes subject to interpretation I guess for many of the rifles that pass through the CMP and ultimately up to the buyer to determine what feeds the need.

If the rifle came from the Army to the CMP, then only the Army could have put on the barrel. Am I missing something?
If a legit M1D is just built up around a 555 barrel, then any rifle with a 555 barrel is legit.

[seaninmich]

If the rifle came from the Army to the CMP, then only the Army could have put on the barrel. Am I missing something?
If a legit M1D is just built up around a 555 barrel, then any rifle with a 555 barrel is legit.


Couple problems with that.

1) just because they "come from the army" does not mean that they haven't been around the world twice in the last 75 years.

2) I know for a fact that they were making Ds in Europe. Am I the only one that remembers the NOS D barrels being sold out of Greece or 7 years ago??? If they sent all the barrels to Greece, solid bet that some were put on there

[sandsnow]

Couple problems with that.

1) just because they "come from the army" does not mean that they haven't been around the world twice in the last 75 years.

2) I know for a fact that they were making Ds in Europe. Am I the only one that remembers the NOS D barrels being sold out of Greece or 7 years ago??? If they sent all the barrels to Greece, solid bet that some were put on there

Good point. Plus you got all the accessories coming out of there also.

Good bet my CMP M1D is a put together. It was Greek black rifle. Well I think it was Greek black. I heard some stories that not all blacks were Greeks.

Without Army records we'll never know. I guess you're pretty safe it you got one through DCM.

[LEAD POISON]

The only point I can say is you do get the CMP certificate.
That does mean it did come from the army ??? Like Sean said, around about.

[Old Guard]

The only point I can is you do get the CMP certificate.
That does mean it did come from the army ??? Like Sean said, around about.

M1d , nope, don't own one..Do own a garand with a scope...Original M1D rifles dryed up years ago, I know some members bought one that could be original to the army, and used in Combat?? CMP has the option to mfr. any of these they like, really suspected that many of them were put together.. As stated above, greek armorers or any body else could screw the proper barrel into a reciever..Hell. I did it myself last year....So It is Like a Trophy wife, nice to look at, and most likely worth the trouble..Bragging rights, If I spot a Fake [copy]a friend is proud of, then I let it flow, what's to gain from letting the air out of him? Life goes on, Not likely to order a copy of an M1D rifle, Yet..Tractor gun put together, by Cmp, now that remains to be seen..

[LEAD POISON]

In old military rifles it's hard to prove OR dis prove most anything.
They were not manufactured yesterday. Most went thru many rebuilds.
Never say never.
Just my observations.

[sandsnow]

In old military rifles it's hard to prove OR dis prove most anything.
They were not manufactured yesterday. Most went thru many rebuilds.
Never say never.
Just my observations.

That's true. Take any M1 rifle with DCM paperwork. Who's to say that the barrel hasn't been replaced, or the stock or what have you.

[Old Guard]

The great thing about all this is the CMP makes repro legit. It's a repro sniper rifle with a repro scope, with repro wood that has repro metal. Kind of like one of the fancy commemorative Garands that were sold, or the re-builds that were sold in a fancy wood box. At the end of the day, like a new car, drive it off the lot and deduct 20-30% of the price you paid. Obviously the CMP has to find it much easier to create various Garand configurations that build out all the same, keep the local folks employed, and garner the least bitching and moaning about crappy wood-poor finish-don't meet grading-sight is loose-......less whining to deal with when what you ship is all cookie cutter product.

might as well buy one of those gold plated Imo jima Models Garands, thompsons,or the simular 1911a1 .45's to keep in a box..I like to play with my toys, If I bought a Repro Sniper M1D, then it would have to be played with too?

[Old Guard]

Just read another description on Ebay from a guy selling an M1D barrel, it does not have the last 555 number, He nearly told the guy to pound sand..Defintely a high price for the product, if it was not a 'Sniper" barrel..

[sandsnow]

Just read another description on Ebay from a guy selling an M1D barrel, it does not have the last 555 number, He nearly told the guy to pound sand..Defintely a high price for the product, if it was not a 'Sniper" barrel..

According to CMP there are legit D barrels that do not have 555. No source, just armorer said so.

[Old Guard]

According to CMP there are legit D barrels that do not have 555. No source, just armorer said so.

Ha," Read it on the internet, so it Must be true" ??Really, I have no Doubt, that they used what ever they could find...In a Pinch, Like saying no use of Ap ammo on personell? I have not ever had a 555 barrel to check, nor do I expect to happen on one.. But I do love to see the 0 and plus 1 readings on some from the CMP..Around here the new-in-the-wrap barrels are made of gold, as many folks just don't have garands or parts to them..

[RGBvr]

Around here the new-in-the-wrap barrels are made of gold

Almost true, I recently acquired one with a 4-44 Date Code. I bought it to correct my 7-44 SA Garand, which has a very good 2-43 barrel (Chamber in the white with black pads)installed in it. I have a barrel vice and action wrench, but still need to decide whether to buy a pull through reamer, or send it out.

Richard

[Old Guard]

I have noted a couple in the cases at one of the LGS, but they are not tagged, and when ever I have asked the owner for a price on anything there..It hurts my wallet pocket....I had couple very nice service grade barrels with nearly new readings too...If I were you, I would sit on that spare barrel if the 2-43 performs well already, as who can tell what it will be worth in couple more years...I was very happy with my so-so barrels that came from Sarco, They are pitted, but the rifling is perfect, and they shoot very good for me..they are the italian 7.62 type2 version and are being closed out at less than $50.00, each..