battle tested circus tent

[Brinks352]

I guess aloreman doesn't like Battle Tested very much.

http://forums.thecmp.org/showthread.php?t=187200

[timshufflin]

I don't know what to say. 1. If I buy a Curio firearm and leave it original, then sell it, there is not manufacturing. 2. If I buy a firearm, and modify it, then sell it, I am now manufacturing. I had to get my manufacturers license for the sole reason of making the Mini-G and the mag fed versions if I first buy and then sell the firearm.

Now, when someone else sends me a rifle to be modified for their use, that's Gunsmithing.

It saddens me that there are people who are so savagely mean in their remarks, so certain that they are right, so vicious in standing for their truth, and then they are WRONG.

FYI, I originally had an FFL 01. I had told the ATF that I was making the Mini-G, parkerizing, blah blah. During my first inspection, the ATF agent saw what I was doing and said that I was manufacturing. I had to immediately, on the spot, apply and get my FFL 07 manufacturing. aloreman may be right, aloreman may be smarter than anyone else. This doesn't change the fact that the ATF says he's wrong and the ATF is the agency that writes the fines. I fill out a manufacturers report every year. You go over the 50, excise tax 10%. End of story.

As to the circus tent, YEE HAA!

[timshufflin]

By the way, here's a link with the 50 gun exemption listed.
http://www.ttb.gov/firearms/faet-faqs.shtml

This is called the small manufacturers exemption. I have no idea why this aloreman has such disdain for everything Shuff. I have no idea why when he voices his "facts" that he takes such absolute positions on things. Nobody knows everything and there is always more than one way to skin a cat. That is unless you are talking politics and ones' personal freedoms :)

[jak]

I met and talked to aloreman at a couple of shoots. He does think he knows everything and is never wrong.
Now, I just try to avoid him. At the matches where we shot, he did rack up some decent scores, so I guess
that helps feed his ego.

[timshufflin]

I met and talked to aloreman at a couple of shoots. He does think he knows everything and is never wrong.
Now, I just try to avoid him. At the matches where we shot, he did rack up some decent scores, so I guess
that helps feed his ego.

Well, I've noticed a bunch in this business have big ego's. I try to stay low key about Garand Knowledge (whatever that is). Take a page from Gus Fisher or Roland Beaver, guys who actually know stuff and don't speak in absolutes ( the two did get in one pissing match over red loctiting barrels). This hobby, business, whatever we call it, shouldn't be about one upping the next guy. I heard it said years ago on Jouster, believe it or not "we gun guys tend to eat our own." It's damn true.

[timshufflin]

I see Eli posted that refinishing a firearm for sale is manufacturing. Eli is correct. Take a look at this link https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/atf-national-firearms-act-handbook-chapter-7/download

Is there a loophole aloreman knows about? I don't know but if there is I'd like to know it. Here's the vital information from the link I gave.

7.2.2 “Manufacturing”. “Manufacturing” is not defined by the law, regulations, or any formal ATFruling. Nevertheless, the term has been interpreted by ATF to cover activities other than producing afirearm from scratch. As interpreted by ATF, the term covers virtually any work performed on a firearmduring the process of preparing the firearm for subsequent sale. For example, a person having a contractwith a manufacturer to apply finishing or other work on firearms, or firearms frames or receivers, toprepare them for subsequent sale by the manufacturer would be a “manufacturer” required to qualify assuch. Of course, if the person produced firearms parts other than frames or receivers for themanufacturer or performed work on firearms parts not defined as “firearms,” the person would not be a“manufacturer.”

[Brinks352]

Always great information here.

It had been a little quite lately. :)

[ordmm]

Interesting exchange to say the least over on the CMP site. Reminds me why there is "a list".

[canes7]

I saw that comment and wondered what he would know about it? Has he ever visited this forum? If he did what was his username? How did he come away form the visit with this opinion?

I bet he knows nothing.

[seaninmich]

Loreman is a simple case of "his ego is much larger than his knowledge base". We see it over there all the time. Anyone else notice that the worst offenders tend to by big GCA supporters?

[seaninmich]

By the way, when did we get a tent and unicycles? I was left out. Next year can we save up and get one of those clown cars that, like, 50 of us can fit in?

[mxlmax]

The more you know the more you know you don't know. You really can't know too much but you can sure act like you do when you don't really. I never could learn much of anything by talking....you have to listen to learn (and read). But I am only stating the obvious.

[seaninmich]

LOL! and the thread got deleted. First loreman hijacked it, then he must have begged the mods to delete it since he just made a complete fool of himself

[Prince Humperdink]

I was too late :(

[seaninmich]

I was too late :(

did you miss it entirely? I have screen shots of the entire thread.

[timshufflin]

I don't know that aloreman made a fool of himself, he just showed ignorance on the topic. Nobody can know everything but you don't come out and belittle someone (me) by insinuating that they're so stupid that they don't know the law for their own business. It comes off as plain mean if you're right and you look like a complete moron when you're wrong. This time, aloreman was completely wrong on every point. By the way, if your shop is getting ATF inspections every year you are not doing something right. Aloreman mentioned that he did get inspections every year. The people in my area, we're a pretty close group, get inspections every 4 or 5 years because we qualify for that process with 100%'s on our ATF inspections.

[seaninmich]

I don't know that aloreman made a fool of himself, he just showed ignorance on the topic.

When you represent a false statement as fact because you haven't educated yourself, that makes you ignorant. When people generously provide you with information that disproves your claim and you continue to stand your ground, that makes you a fool

[ordmm]

did you miss it entirely? I have screen shots of the entire thread.

If it 's not some kind of violation of rules post the whole thing. Some good info posted on that thread.

[timshufflin]

When you represent a false statement as fact because you haven't educated yourself, that makes you ignorant. When people generously provide you with information that disproves your claim and you continue to stand your ground, that makes you a fool

Alright, the part about actually seeing the regulations and still not admitting he was wrong was foolish on aloreman's behalf. In fact, aloreman started changing how he represented himself in earlier comments. That part was very disappointing. Argue with integrity and don't make your position out to be something that it wasn't aloreman.

There's no rule against posting that thread here is someone should have it, so long as there's no profanity.

[Punch The Clown]

Did someone say Circus?

1868

[cuppednlocked]

Damn, I should have read the last part today. I must have missed the big ending.

[cannonshooter]

18691870

did some one say they needed a circus tent? its really only good for one ring but what the heck. Its mine lol
Mack

[musketjon]

I missed the whole thing. If anyone cares to post the circus........................................
Jon

[timshufflin]

Sean has now told me he has "the tape".

[seaninmich]

I have the screenshots in photobucket. I've been trying for over an hour to post them here. This site keeps giving me errors no matter what format I try to use to post them

[Prince Humperdink]

Yes Sean,I did miss the whole thing.If you figure out how to post it,that would be great.

[seaninmich]

Yes Sean,I did miss the whole thing.If you figure out how to post it,that would be great.

i give up. I can't get them to post. sorry. the forum won't let me post them no matter what I do

[timshufflin]

i give up. I can't get them to post. sorry. the forum won't let me post them no matter what I do

Yes, just give up. That's what I've always tried to teach my children.

[musketjon]

Can you give us the Reader's Digest version?
Jon

[Eli]

Can you give us the Reader's Digest version?
Jon

Somebody doesn't understand the law, and was adamant that they were right even after being proven wrong. Oh, and attempted ridiculing of BT.

Eli